TELL TATHATA | With the basic full swing training concluding at the end of this chapter, what questions do you still have about your full swing motion?

[Tathata Staff]

[Rudy]

What starts the downswing ? When do you begin to surf the knees ? The biggest problem that i have is that backward movement of the hips ? Can’t integrate into swing.

[Tathata Staff]

Rudy,

Great question. The hips simply need to feel as though they are pushing back a touch just so that they don’t come forward. Working on “Surf the Knees” and “Snap to Level” movements from the body movement routine can help to train the feeling at the start of the downswing. One part of the body does not lead over others. As the knees surf, this gets the lower body and upper body in the proper position coming down. Notice as you do this during the surf to level movement as your hips, knees and shoulders all become parallel to the target line, there should also be a slight tilt in them away from the target as well. Notice to make this happen, the knees have “surfed.” In other words, as the shoulders, hips and knees finish the movement all are parallel to the target line and parallel to each other with a bit of tilt away from the target. Here the front knee is outside of the front foot and front hip is just about even with the front foot.

If you are hitting these check points in the surf to level movement you can be sure that you are moving properly from the top of your downswing.

[Rick]

Just completed Day 31 which introduced the width of your stance changing with PW and Driver from the stock 7 iron we have been practicing. My question is does the ball position of the stock 7 iron which was in line with the left ear for a righty remain the same for all clubs.

[Tathata Staff]

Rick,

Great question. On a stock 7-iron the ball position as it relates to the left ear would remain the same given that the stance is set up correctly, meaning that you are strong, ready and balanced. As you will come to know the stance itself is dependent on the shape and trajectory you are creating. With that said if you were to widen the stance for massive strength and create more leverage, the ball would still be off of the left ear but now is a little further away from your left foot. In other words the old adage on a certain amount of inches off of or inside the foot does not apply to properly set up for movement.

As for a stock wedge we would still prescribe you having the ball off the left ear, but for driver this will be dependent on your stance and skill through the body movements. Given that you can move as shown in Chapter 1 and depending on how wide your stance is, the ball position on a driver can be left of the left ear a bit. Meaning that with a strong, wide and athletic stance the ball would be a couple inches left of the left ear. It is not dependent on the left foot, it is dependent on how well you move into “surf to level” and the thrust back and up to the front side crescent. It would be safe to say that the ball position on a driver would be a couple inches left of the left ear.

We are honored you are going through the program. Thank you for the time and energy you are putting into this. We are smiling with you.

[Bob]

I’m getting close to playing and I wonder if there is any one thing we should think about when standing over a shot on the course. Am I wrong in thinking that we should just think ‘out in front’ and forget any thoughts of pressure, surfing, hip movement, or any of the other things we’ve been working on? What is the best way to integrate what we have been working on into our golf game?

[Tathata Staff]

Bob,

Great question. It’s not wrong to think of mechanics or different things you are trying to feel especially as you continue to build these movements into your motion on the course/range. When we say looking out in front while over a shot, this would be the feeling of already sensing the ball rolling down the middle of the fairway, the ball landing close to the pin and letting this sense and energy simply draw you to it. Standing on a tee there is a sense that the target (middle of the fairway) is almost pulling your ball down it. Hitting a shot into the green there is a sense of the short putt upcoming and the flag drawing your swing and ball to it. Through your training you know how to move and your body will react to these senses and energy.

As the movements are still new though there is nothing wrong with thinking about them and trying to feel them in your game as you take your training to the course though. As your continue to get more comfortable, the idea would be to move away from these specific swing thoughts and move into a place that you are simply feeling the target pulling you and your ball to it. The best score you have ever shot on the front 9 at your home course pulling you to it from the first tee on. The more you can start to sense these things the better your performance and more free your game of golf will be.

Thank you for the time and energy you are putting into the training.

[Tom]

When I am playing on the course the pressure really helps control my swing but my iron shots are going just right of target. I am a lefty. I think it is because during impact I am surfing the knees but not pushing back with the right hip during follow thru. Any suggestions while I am on the range?
TomR

[Tathata Staff]

Tom,

Interesting question, without seeing your swing and checking a number of things I will try to offer a few suggestions. One thing I would check to make sure you are doing correctly is Body Movement 7 – Surf to Level. At the finish of this movement are your shoulders, hips and knees all parallel to the target line? Being left-handed and struggling with shots to the right I would suggest doing this movement so that your shoulders, hips and knees all finish about 5 degrees left of the target or “closed” to your target line. Can you feel this? Be sure too that when you finish your front shoulder, hip and knee are further from the ground than your back shoulder, hip and knee.

Another place to check would be Body Movement 10 – Thrust Through Impact. At the finish of this movement is the front shoulder, hip and knee further from the ground than your back shoulder, hip and knee? This will help to make sure you are pushing back in your glutes properly like you had mentioned while making sure the club face does not have a tendency to slightly close through impact. Play with this, you will notice the more angle you have in your shoulders and hips here, the more pushed back you will be in your glutes and less of a tendency the ball will have to go right. It will be helpful to continue this feeling to the finish with your front shoulder and hip further from the ground than your back shoulder and hip.

Let us know if these remedies help or if we can help you further. All of our students benefit from learning from these questions from other students in the forums.

Thank you and happy training.

[Gerald]

One issue is integrating all of the movements into your swing and finding a balance. Taking an online course, you wonder if you are going “too far” with a particular movement or not enough. Some of the issues are resolved with more repetition – time.

Second, as to making contact with the ball, I was experiencing excessive toe hits. I think this issue originated because the right arm while surfing returned to the body, but what about the clubhead? What path does it take? Now Bryan has an overlooked video on the clubhead going out (seemingly over the top) to show if you are making the proper lower body movemement, the arms can go out.

I’d like him to take this one step further with a golf club to show the arms in, clubhead out and emphasize that movement. After day 31, I had a lesson with my “live” instructor and he noticed my arms at my side as well as my clubhead, so my club path was greater than 7 degrees in to out — we had worked on getting that to decrease, but I’d neglected that movement in favor of training. He pointed it out and I remembered Bryan’s short vid on the arms. So my instructor and I spent an hour getting me back on two issues (my tendencies from earlier training) — arms too attached to chest on backswing causing clubhead to get too far inside, and clubhead too inside (not out) on downswing. I also found that I was smothering the ball left. What happened is that I surfed, but my lower body was not opening up sufficiently. As a result, I’ve reviewed my rhythm/tempo to give my lower body time to open up so I can launch the ball

I think that is the weakness of video training — not having enough camera angles for our viewing experience. It cannot do everything, but hopefully feedback helps improve the program.

With my “live” instructor training, I was able to correct these issues after a couple of sessions of hitting balls. Now it’s back to repeating basic movements and finding that balance. As a note, my live instructor did like the lower body movements and “posting up” at the finish of the swing.

[Tathata Staff]

Hi Gerald,

Great thoughts, thank you for taking the time to provide your feedback and comments. Supporting and future products will help to address more camera angles and details of each movements.

To further support students training online across the world, our Movement Specialist Program launched this past February. Individuals and professionals in the golf, fitness and education industries are currently training to become certified to assess Tathata students’ movements in local areas across the country and world-wide. Movement Specialists will start to become certified this summer and available to seek out to further support your training and movements.

In regards to your comments about the path of the clubhead as we surf, make sure during the Snap to Level movement that the knees, hips and shoulders are all parallel to the ground and parallel to the target line at the same time. When training, you can even practice to have the knees, hips and shoulders 0-5 degrees open to the target line when they are all parallel to the ground. The back knee, hip and shoulder should be slightly closer to the ground than the front hip, knee and shoulder. All of these body parts aimed 0-5 degrees open at the completion of the movement should help any lack of turning on the downswing with the body. Relating to the hands and arms, the hands and arms are out at the start of the downswing and very much in front of the body because of the surfing motion. As they move into impact the hands and arms come in toward the body and the club head moves out. This is talked about in chapter 3 through the impact section and the deeper discussion, hand path through impact.

Thank you Gerald for the time and energy you are putting into the training and the great feedback as you move throughout the training!

[Gerald]

Thanks for your response above and clarification. I appreciate it. What I’ve done after Day 32 and a few rounds of golf is to go back and review basic movements. For example, I reviewed Chapters 11-13 today. One finds many crucual nuggets and sees more upon further review.

[Ronald]

I understand that the hands come in towards the body at impact. Should the hands be the same distance from the body at impact as they were at address?

[Gerald]

As to my post above, I had only gone to Lesson 31. Having now taken Lesson 32, I see that Bryan discusses in greater detail my big issue — the drop of the club at transition and it falling behind you. After viewing, I understand that the arms go over the top to get the clubhead outside but since your glutes are working back, the club is still coming from the inside.

My “live” instructor and I have worked on that issue for about 4 lessons – we had a breakthrough yesterday, and today, I saw Bryan’s explanation in lesson 32. Amazing how my guy and Bryan are a bit in synch.

I had trouble feeling the squat and was squatting too much, so my instructor asked me to feel as if the right foot was moving backwards and the front (left) foor pushing forwards, and that got the clubhead in front and as long as arms were in, I did not have to think the movement of the feet, with surfing and then thrusting, threw the clubhead out, and as long as the arms stayed in and on the body … and I felt more of the squat and ground pressure. Good things…

[Tathata Staff]

Thanks Gerald for following up, it’s great to hear you and your instructor’s thoughts and experiences with the training. We’re glad you are enjoying the process and are able to share and improve right along with your current instructor. Let us know if you have any further questions.

[Tathata Staff]

Ronald,

Great question. The hands can be the same distance away from the body as they were at address or slightly closer. Since the glutes will be pushed slightly further back coming into impact than at setup and the legs and lower body will be slightly lower to the ground coming into impact than at setup, the handle can be roughly the same distance from the body at impact than it was at setup and still be in a strong and correct position. The pelvis thrusting through impact will help to make sure the hands never get too close but certainly the closer the better.

[Gerald]

Being a more mature golfer who also does the flexibility exercises on an almost daily basis, I have some issue finishing with my right shoulder down and into the crescent moon with Superman pose — I lose balance and want to come out of the crescent moon. I feel as if it is costing me consistency and speed.

Any additional flexibility exercises or suggestions?

Thanks again for the program.

[Tathata Staff]

Gerald,

Great question, sorry to hear you are struggling with this portion of the swing. The crescent position at the finish is intended to actually help maintain and even increase speed in the swing after impact and to the finish. It is also the best way to move to protect your back from injury and make sure your body is moving as safe as possible to your finish. If you are struggling to get the crescent position on the front of your body we would suggest being sure that your rib cage and chest are lifting up to the sky as much as they can at the finish. You will notice this is very similar to the hands and feet both pushing to the walls of the room while performing the superman pose from the stretching routine. It will also help to squeeze the glutes together and be sure they are pushed as far forward as possible and tucked up underneath the pelvis.

If you are struggling to keep the crescent shape on the left side of your body (for a RH player) we would recommend revisiting Body Movement 9: Hug Through Impact. As you perform this movement and attempt to maintain the front side crescent shape on the left side of your body, it may help to imagine your left elbow and right hand in the left arm pit, throwing a punch straight up vertically and hitting something as you finish the movement. Can you visualize this? Instead of the elbow punching something behind you in more of a horizontal direction, imagine striking something near the end of the movement where this elbow would be moving almost only vertically. Does this help you maintain the crescent shape on the left side of your body and move with speed to your finish? Do you feel the difference of the left elbow moving horizontally to the ground throwing a punch rather than almost entirely vertically at the end of this movement? Are you able to maintain speed to your finish while keying on this? You can apply this same feeling to Body Movement 12: Ribs to Finish as you train as well.

We hope this helps, let us know if we can provide any further clarification or assistance. Thank you and happy training.